Talk:The Superhuman Gambit

I found that it is possible to kill the AntAgonizer as she's leaving Canterbury for the first time, I kept hitting her with a pipe, her health didn't decline for a while, and she drew her Ripper. Just as she was getting to her hideout, her health went to 0 and died in front of the door. Was super easy to complete quest from there, just take her stuff and talk to Roe. Simple and effective! =D

Looking to kill both quickly, but neither takes any damage. Any help?
 * They are immune until after their scene and start walking away. At that point you can kill them. --DarkJeff 22:20, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Not true. You can kill them before the quest even starts, or at least the AntAgonizer. I just run up and start unloading on her. Her health does not appear to drop, and she certainly takes a huge number of bullets, but she can be killed. Crippling her legs will keep her from running off as quickly. After this, the Mechanist will disappear and Uncle Roe will thank you and give you your 400 caps.

I've done this twice now.Atten418 22:42, 25 December 2008 (UTC)Atten418

The Robot Repair Center has a broken elevator for robots in Sector B. Has anyone figured out how to fix it, or is it just meant for the thrill of watching the bots fall to their death? -RedKnight7 08:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

How do you get both bonus weapons? I think it's impossible to get both.

I decided to get the Protectron's Gaze from the mechanist long after completing the quest and can't find him at his usual place (RobCo factory) or the Canterbury Commons (although there is a friendly sentry bot there now) can anyone help? (Xbox360)

Trouble getting both costumes?
I had trouble with the instructions given to get both rewards so I thought I'd just share the way I finally managed it.

The antagonizer at first refused to change clothes for me, I was able to get her outfit (finally) by giving her a hockey mask (average val) then going out and coming back, and then giving her a raiders badlands armour (almost 100%) and then going out and coming back in. Thus getting me the antagoinzers outfit.

Over at the mechanists place, after getting my reward for giving him the antagonizers outfit, I ran into the same problem again of not being able to get him to change. Rather than going through my collection of apparel to find what he would change into I simply sneak attacked him got his outfit, the antagonizers outfit back plus his equipped weapon (laser pistol).

Then back over to the Antagonizers place got my reward then sneak attacked her took out her guard ants and then got everything back off, her including my hockey mask and raiders armour.

Finally over to see Uncle Roe to collect 600 caps and all finished

hopefully this helps any other people struggling with the instructions in the article

(Xbox360) I found that if you enter Canterbury Commons for the first time, encountering the two 'superheros' that if you killed them both (such as reverse-pickpocketing mines or frag grenades) when Uncle Roe comes out of the building to give you the quest, instead he will just thank you and give you the reward thus ending the quest. Since you didnt officially start the quest, upon completion, xbox 360 users won't unlock the achievement for the quest. 68.150.224.5 15:26, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Update 12 June 2009: On the Ps3, I have confirmed that this method works. I used a stealth boy, snuck up to the AntAgonizer slowly on her throne, reverse pickpocket and give her a moderately repaired raider armor (I think I used "badlands"? variation), walk out, go back in, pickpocket for her costume, run to the Mechanist's hideout, talk to him, give him Ant's costume, as he walks out, kill him, grab his costume, run back to the Antagonizer, give her his, then kill her, grab everything back. I got both unique weapons, plus both costumes, then with speech check, got 600 caps from Uncle Roe and completed the quest, and still got the trophy from Ps3 version. I was level 15, I used the Blackhawk to kill them quick.--SoCash 06:51, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Speech Challenge difficulty
Some sources have suggested that the antagonizers speech challenge is easy. I found the mechanist was easy 73% (with a ~70 speech (modified with gear)), and the antagonizers was low ~35%? My Karma was very good, does karma affect the chllenges? (The "hero" being easier if good, the "villain" being easier if evil...) -Docgratis- 75.148.199.242 15:49, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Mechanist's destination after leaving Canterbury Commons
In my game (PC), I first convinced AntAgonizer to stop using Lady Killer dialog choice, then went to Mechanizer and convinced him to stop using Speech check. When following Mechanizer, I noticed that he walked right through the round plaza in front of Canterbury Commons town, circled westwards around the small hill with AntAgonizer's lair, climbed that hill from "behind" (northern side) and kept standing right next to the top hatch to AntAgonizer's lair. Can anyone confirm this? 15.203.233.77 15:30, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

It seems he goes where ever the antagonizer was. I followed the antagonizer out after the speech check, and she got mauled by a deathclaw. Then I followed the mechanist, and he stood around where her body was. (her body dissapeared)Tehuberleetmaster 17:06, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

Added a way to kill them during their confrontation
You can kill them both during their initial confrontation by planting live mines or hand grenades on them. I did this on the 360, it might not work the same on other platforms. Also, my level 12 character had 100 stealth, 100 explosives, the silent running perk, and all three level of the demolition expert perk - I don't know if that made a difference or not, but I'm sure it made it easier for me to accomplish. I didn't see information on this method anywhere on the page so I added it under the "tips" section.

-I just walked up to the AntAgonizer with the victory rifle and unloaded 2 clips (10 rounds) into her head, i am sure it could take take less but after a few seconds she isn't invincible anymore.

Tips

 * There is an extremely quick way to complete this quest. Just plant a live mine or frag grenade on the Mechanist and the AntAgonizer during their initial confrontation. You have to be very quick, however, as that when one dies the other runs off almost immediately. Uncle Roe will marvel at how you just "walked into town" and took care of them after all of the trouble they had caused, and will give you 400 caps for your trouble. You can still loot the bodies, but you won't receive either of their special weapons. (It is possible to get the same effect by just shooting them both, or in my case setting them on fire. If you end up only killing one the other completely disappears from the game.)


 * Using the Mesmetron, it is possible to frenzy one or both of the "characters" during their initial confrontation. After they have been frenzied, all units in the area will attack them (even their own "servants"). Interestingly, if they are frenzied the characters become killable (even though you are not supposed able to kill them during their conversation). This is any easy way to kill both characters, and receive the FULL award, meaning that if one of them dies you will receive 400 caps and if both die you will receive 600.


 * There is a Stealth Boy on a shelf in the installation area of AntAgonizer's Lair. It can be used to sneak past Sector B of the Mechanist's Lair. This makes it possible for a low level to reach the Mechanist without any investment in lockpicking.


 * If you're Evil, you can kill both the Mechanist, AntAgonizer and everyone in Canterbury Commons except Derek. He will let you complete the quest and earn 600 caps.


 * If you get the encryption key out of the Easy safe near the terminal on the upper level of Sector A (southwest corner), you can cause a pulse wave explosion in Sector A that will damage robots or cripple their combat inhibitors, causing them to attack each other, thus making your job much easier. However, unless you have high enough Sneak, you have to run a gauntlet of turret fire to get up to this control room. If you went directly through the Mechanist's elevator, though, this "back door" approach is cake. The pulse wave can completely take out the two turrets and the Sentry Bot in Sector A, but it appears the player is denied XP by using this method.


 * Alternatively, if you can handle an Average lock, open the door in the northwest office area. Immediately go left (down the ramp), then right, through the small doorway, and hack the Easy terminal. Turn off the Sector A defenses and fight the lone Sentry Bot opponent. Now go up the stairs to the control room between Sectors A and B, and hack the Easy terminal there to friendly ALL defenses in Sector B, including the wandering robots. You will take a few turret hits initially, but otherwise the entire Robot Repair Center amounts to fighting just one Sentry Bot, with this approach.


 * To bypass the Hard locked elevator to the Mechanist's Forge just go through the "secret" entrance then continue around and up the elevator. It will no longer be locked.


 * Male characters with the Lady Killer and Child At Heart perks have it easy getting through this quest with few if any casualties, as you can convince the Mechanist to give up using the Child at Heart perk, and can convince the AntAgonizer to give up using the Lady Killer perk.


 * Just a word of advice. If you stopped the AntAgonizer first and on your way to stop the Mechanist, make sure your not wearing the AntAgonizers armor as the Mechanist will believe you're the AntAgonizer and attack you, forcing you to kill him.

Receiving Both Reward Items
It is possible to complete this quest in a way that you'll receive both unique weapons: the Ant's Sting, and the Protectron's Gaze. After accepting the quest from Uncle Roe, proceed into the AntAgonizer's Lair. Save your game before approaching her. If you initiate dialogue with her, you'll be forced to resolve the quest now (which you don't want to do yet). If you're careful, you can get barely into range to steal from her without triggering dialogue. Plant some armor and a helmet on her (good condition Raider equipment will do). Now leave her lair, and re-enter it. She should have taken off her costume, which you can now steal. Steal it.

(*If you didn't bring good enough armor/helmet there is a sewer grate to the right of the throne which leads to Canterbury Commons so you don't have to go all the way back through the tunnels

(semi repaired combat armour works fine and is alot easier to find for them than power armor)

(*Note that the AntAgonizer and/or Mechanist may or may NOT actually remove their respective costume! It is advised that the player save before re-entering the AntAgonizer and Mechanist's "lairs" due to this. If you enter and the character has not removed their costume, reload and try again. You may also leave and re-enter VS saving and reloading, however, this may take a while or may not happen at all... PLUS if you are using stealth boys, this method may require the use of more than one unit. Regardless, I have had both methods work for me.)

(*Note If you reverse pickpocket them while they are "facing off" in town at the start of The Superhuman Gambit seems to be the easiest. Also generic Power Armor appears to work best for the Mechanist and nicely repaired Combat or Raider armor seems to work well for the AntAgonizer.)

Leave the AntAgonist's Lair again and head over to the Mechanist's Hideout, and gain entry to his room. The best way to do this will be to proceed straight inside and lockpick the elevator (requires 75 lockpick skill). This will give you the version of his room with the long hallway, so you'll have more time for thieving. (If you don't have the requisite 75 lockpick skill then head around the other way. Once you have opened the "secret" entrance and cross the threshold he will start to walk towards you. If you time it right you can then jump over the table and head out the other door with the long hallway) Approach the Mechanist and he will initate dialogue. Give him the AntAgonizer's costume, and he'll reward you with the Protectron's Gaze as if you'd killed her. He'll thank you kindly and take off down the hall, but don't let him go quite yet. Go into sneak mode and steal from him, planting yet another set of armor/helmet (again, Raider equipment will do) on him. When he passes through the elevator door, follow him through, and you'll find that he has taken off his costume. Steal it. While you're at it, take the AntAgonizer's costume back, too! Might as well grab all the unique items possible.


 * It is possible to pickpocket The Mechanist without initiating dialog, despite him "homing in" on you. Lockpicking in the back door, he will home in only when you cross the threshold of the door to his room. Sneak over the threshold, but back away right before he can get in range to speak. If you did this correctly he will stop, facing backwards, closer to the door - you should be able to "reach across" the threshold of the door to pickpocket him. Key point: as soon as you cross the threshold of the door, he will speak with you, so lure him closer to the door then run away, and then come back.

Now quickly head back to the AntAgonizer's Lair and give her the Mechanists' costume. She'll thank you kindly and reward you with the Ant's Sting as if you'd killed the Mechanist. Might as well go ahead and steal the Mechanist's Costume back from her while you're here.

You can't return to Uncle Roe yet for your reward because neither the AntAgonizer nor the Mechanist are actually dead. To resolve the quest, follow the AntAgonizer as she leaves her lair. She'll walk outside, and head over toward the Mechanist's place. Meanwhile the Mechanist will already be en route to the AntAgonizer's Lair. They'll meet halfway, and fight to the death. Talk to whoever survives to get thanked for the third time, and head over to Uncle Roe to formally complete the quest. This should net you a complete set of AntAgonist armor, a complete set of Mechanist armor, the Protectron, the Ant's Sting, and the caps reward from Uncle Roe.

(NOTE: As of the latest patch v1.7, when these two guys do meet and fight to the death, you will not receive the option to get "thanked" for the third time. You will need to kill whoever survives. In my case, after the Antagonizer kills the Mechanist, I followed her and we bumped into Outcasts and Enclave troops in a battle. When she died in the battle, the quest can now be finished as if you made them leave peacefully, thereby giving you a bonus in caps)


 * If you don't mind killing both the Mechanist and the AntAgonizer, you can first reverse pickpocket the AntAgonizer, get her costume, go to the Mechanist, get the Protectron's Gaze and then kill him, getting both costumes, and then going back to the AntAgonizer, get the Ant's Sting, and kill her for the costume she took. You get the AntAgonizer's costume, the Mechanist's costume, Protectron's Gaze, and the Ant's Sting, as well as (of course) the caps from Uncle Roe, including the bonus for killing both of them.


 * This method of obtaining both costumes and weapons confirmed on Playstation 3. If you want to do this without killing either of them however, rather than the above explanation it is actually better to plant a good quality raider armor on the AntAgonizer and preferably any set of power armor on the Mechanist both during their initial meeting in front of Canterburry Commons. This is simple when using a stealth boy. Then go to the AntAgonizer's lair and pickpocket her costume from her since she will be wearing the raider armor. She is alot easier to pickpocket with a stealth boy because you can get her from the side, while pickpocketing the Mechanist is very difficult if attempting it before talking to him. Take the AntAgonizer's armor to the Mechanist (who will now be clad in the power armor) for the Protectron's Gaze, and pickpocket the Mechanist's costume off him from behind as he's walking away. Take this back to the AntAgonizer for the Ant's Sting, and again pickpocket the costume from behind as she heads towards the rear exit. BlacKRaiN 666 12:29, October 14, 2009 (UTC)

Receiving Two Sets of Both Costumes
Using a variant of the above, it is possible to gain two sets of each costume and good karma. Proceed with pickpocketing both as normal - not initiating dialog with either. (Use the threshold trick with The Mechanist.) Then proceed to speak with each, using the speech option to have them "give up their ways". They will turn over their costumes - resulting in two sets (one stolen, one "generated" via quest trigger). You can now equip a follower (this only works with clover and butch due to their default armor having low enough DR) to reenact the adventures of The Mechanist and Mechano-Lad, or The AntAgonist and her Royal Guard. Note, should you use this method to receive 2 sets of a costume, you won't be able to receive the weapon they would have given you if you gave them the corresponding costume as well.

There is another way of receiving two sets of costumes, albeit a bit trickier, that doesn't involve stealing or the Mesmetron. If you are playing a female and have the Black Widow perk you should go to The Mechanist and speak with him about joining. After that, an extra dialog option will appear thanks to the Black Widow perk that will convince The Mechanist that all his actions are dangerous to the city. He will realize his mistake and will give his costume away. Now all that remains is to learn more about AntAgonizer. First, you must speak with Derek about the superheros. He will explain that Joe Porter knows something more. Asking Joe about AntAgonizer will reveal some sad information about the identity of AntAgonizer. All that's left to do now is go to her lair and try to convince her that humanity isn't all that evil (with a Speech check). If you pass the check, she will realize that she is human too, and will give up the costume. Go back and report job done. The same effect can be done with Lady Killer perk when playing as a male character.

An even easier way to get both costumes is side with the mechanist and fight off the AntAgonizer, after defeating her, do not hand over the costume, but say there is more pressing matters in the wastes, the mechanist will say he trusts you because you are his loyal sidekick. He will then say he must go then just follow him, he will walk for around 30 seconds until he reaches a sentry bot, the bot quickly dispatches him, and thus you lose no karma and theres both costumes. Kingclyde 17:27, 29 May 2009 (UTC)kingclyde

getting both armors and both weapons there is a way to get all the weapons and armor from this quest. it comes with a heap of bad karma but nothing that can't be washed away if you ask me. first get to one of the lairs you can just talk to them, if you'll find a peacefull solution. then reverse pickpocket armor on to them thats beter then the ones they are wearing. give both the armor to make them leave and give you their special weapon, while they leave pickpocket them again to claim back the armor. finish the quest for full money.

i just found out it seems that doin this causes a glitch, if you do this it will remain optional that you must remove both of them, however if killed the mark too remove them still remains at thier death body and you can't talk to uncle joe too finish it

judge a little early on that, seem you can kill on or both afther getting the weapon, tell uncle joe whats on your tap and tell him 1 or both are gone and get you pay and finish

Receiving both rewards and both costumes
This method will get you both the Ant Sting and the Protectron's Gaze, as well as both costumes and an extra helmet for each one. This also gets you some bad karma, but nothing that can't be easily fixed with donations to churches or water beggars. You will need two sets of armor with a DR above 12 and two sets of headwear with a DR above 4.

-OR- if you want him to live; drop the helmet before you talk to him, then give him the armor and retrieve the Protectron's Gaze, then simply pickpocket the armor and extra helmet from him.
 * Go to the Mechanist and talk to him. Do not convince him to give up his ways or agree to help him. Reverse pickpocket a set of armor and headwear on him, then leave and come back. His attire will change and you will be able to pickpocket his special armor and helmet.
 * Go to the Antagonizer and talk to her. Be sure to drop the Mechanist's armor and helmet before speaking to her. Do the same thing as before and reverse pickpocket the other set of armor and headwear. When she puts it on, you will be able to pickpocket her special armor and helmet as well.
 * Pick up the Mechanist's armor but leave the helmet where it is. Talk to the Antagonizer and give her the armor. She will reward you with the Ant's Sting. She will leave to wander the wastes. You MUST kill the Antagonizer in order to complete the quest at this point. When you loot her body, you will find the Mechanist's armor with an extra helmet to go along with it.
 * Go back to the Mechanist with the Antagonizer's armor in your inventory. Give him the armor and he will reward you with the Protectron's Gaze. Kill the Mechanist and retrieve the Antagonizer's armor with an extra helmet.
 * Talk to Uncle Roe at Canterbury Commons to complete the quest.


 * If you have already have the achievment for the Quest, you can opt to just pickpocket them both with the methods above for both reward weapons, armors, and x2 copies of each helmet. This leaves the quest incomplete, but supplies a random encounter for the capitol wasteland with the Antagonizer (perhaps the Mechanist as well?) at a later time.

Experimental MIRV kill
It's also possible to kill both of the characters, even when they're in the talking scene, with the power of the Experimental MIRV. The eight nukes will take out both of them, and the robots and ants. The bodies will spread out in the air - funny, but It may be hard to find the bodies to loot. Make sure you are at a distance where you kill both of them and you don't turn the town hostile to you. Sometimes the boy might get hit, even though he will take no damage, the town will turn hostile. Uncle Roe will reward you, saying how you just swept out the town. (with a little radiation and nuking)

Rewards
The method described for getting both rewards feels a bit like a cheat or exploit so I would suggest changing the reward box to "Protectron's Gaze or Ant's Sting" rather than "Protectron's Gaze or/and Ant's Sting". I mean its definitely not what the developers had in mind, so you might as well just use the console command if you've got a PC unless your satifaction is for breaking the quest.

You can use this method on the xbox360 & ps3 as well though, which lack console commands.

It may not be what the developers had in mind, but it's not cheating. It's exploiting the game. But why shouldn't we tell people how not to get both rewards? I'm sure many people on PS3 and 360 would like to obtain both rewards, should we just not tell them just because it's not what the developers had in mind (and who knows? Maybe they did intend for smart people to figure out how to do this)? It's doing no harm sitting on the talk page. RudiganRex 00:51, September 29, 2009 (UTC)

It all so makes the game seem more realistic since you can manipulate the people to get more then the developers wanted

AntAngonizer Killed by Her Own Ants
Hi. I just started playing the game and had a result on Superhuman Gambit that I didn't see covered here, so I thought I'd share it. This was on Xbox 360, Fallout 3 Game of the Year Edition with all extra content/add-ons patched-in.

I went to the AntAgonizer's lair through the caverns. During the dialog, I tried the speech check and failed, at which time she and her ants attacked. I jumped from the little platform where the dialog occurred, landed on the round pedestal next to it, and jumped from that and headed toward the cavern door. By this time AntAgonizer and the ants were clustered together at the base of the ramp. I back-pedaled toward the door dropping frag mines; the ants set-off two. At least one critical hit was scored, which I'm guessing was to the antennae, because the ants and AntAgonizer all started fighting each other. She killed all the ants, but the last one killed her. I received the XP/credit for her, but not the ants. Karma was not affected. I went back to town and talked to Roe and got credit for the quest.

Not what I was expecting, but certainly efficient. 74.109.216.192 18:18, January 9, 2010 (UTC)

Never saw battle between Ant and Mech
I did not get to see the battle between the AntAgonizer and the Mechanist when I entered into Cantebury Commons.

Is there any console command that I can use to reset The Battle?

I walked into Cantebury Commons unknowingly, and went into Dom & Machette's House before anything.

When I walked out of the house, Roe ran up to me and the dialog reflected as if I witnessed the battle

between the 2. Every other NPC's dialog also reflects this, But I did not get to see the battle =-/

Any help would be greatly appreciated. —Preceding comment was unsigned. Please sign your posts with ~ !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8MTOcPMX-Y There ya go. Kris (talk) 19:41, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

Where is the coffee machine?
can anybody please post a screenshot of the coffee machine in the mechanist's forge? I've been looking like crazy but can't find it.

Are you in the office or the giant area with robots? The coffee machine is on a table in a room with a desk and filing cabinets, to your left when you walk in. It really isn't hard to find. If you're on the PC, have you installed any mods that might have moved it?

These pictures should answer your question. Oh and before you ask, the room is upstairs and through the door that you find there. RedMarston 16:13, July 29, 2010 (UTC)

Scripting bug?
I saw the fight, but then Uncle Roe initiated dialogue with me before the Mechanist could leave. Now the Mechanist remains where he's standing and won't leave, and repeats the same line over and over again. I may have to revert to an older save. Dethtoll 15:55, March 18, 2010 (UTC)

Repercussions for Canterbury Commons
I solved the Superhuman Gambit by first using the Black Widow dialogue on the Mechanist in his lair, then finding the AntAgonizer in her lair and passing the Speech check to convince her to give up and leave. This was around level 8.

After 3-4 weeks of in-game time, I returned at level 15, and found a friendly Robobrain standing guard at roughly the position that the Mechanist does during the theatrical introduction. Given that the Mechanist was accompanied by a Mister Gutsy and a Protectron during the initial skirmish I witnessed, and neither one survived, I have to wonder if he hasn't returned to the town to try to make amends.

No-one in the town seems to be aware they have a brain on wheels guarding the entrance of their town, and the Mechanist himself is nowhere to be found. Sergeant RL-3 and the Robobrain also get along fine, as opposed to the buggy Sentry Bot noted under "Bugs" in the Canterbury Commons article.

Killing both and still getting the 600 cap reward
After passing Uncle Roe's speech check (level 8, very evil karma), I proceeded to the Antagonizer's lair and after failing the speech check, I killed her and took her costume to the Mechanist, and exchanged it for Protectron's Gaze. After obtaining the weapon, I killed the Mechanist, then proceeded to Uncle Roe, who gave me the full 600 cap reward, saying that i earned the bonus by causing "less stress all around!" I was under the impression that you could only obtain the extra 200 caps by avoiding any bloodshed. Has anyone else come across this? 108.28.49.105 01:49, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

I got the reward even after killing the AntAgonizer, using the reverse pickpocket trick to get both weapons and both armors with extra helmets.--Beefy1223 15:35, October 23, 2010 (UTC)

where is the AntAgonizer?
i am in the forge talking to the mechanist and he said that the antagonizer was attacking but i cant find her what is going on?

Bug that allowed me to get both suits
After getting the info on their lairs, I went over to AntAgonizer's Lair first. Seems it was easy, all i did was jump over the ants till I reached her place. I tried to speak check her and failed (Speech skill was only about 47). She turned hostile and I bolted outta there (jumped over the ants again). Next was the Mechanist's Lair. Since my lockpick was above 75, I used the elevator. I speech checked him and was successful. I later went to Uncle Roe and got my pay (Yes I know I should have gone to AntAgonizer). When I came back to her lair it was empty except the ants. Later I exited Cantebury, explored and found a bed nearby and slept. Woke up and was doing some exploring when out of the blue she appears behind a boulder (scripted event area perhaps?) with four ants. Killed her and looted from her. Random huh? =) [Question: What apparel can be used to repair the costumes?]  Alien_23

I know antagonist's real name, but can't get the speech check option to show. any ideas why?

Derek's dialogue
The article says that Derek will comment that you should be "super-humongous" if Fawkes is your companion, however this happened to me with Charon too. Just FYI. 69.196.141.227 00:31, March 20, 2011 (UTC)