Talk:Jack (weapon)

I found Vengeance
I visited this cave early before enclave but didn't clear it of deadclaws and when I returned after enclave there was jack also vengeance
 * Vengeance is *always* there. Jack shows up with the enclave (its found on an enclave officer). --AshRandom 03:36, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Ridiculous critical damage
With Jack the game checks for critical hits several times per second. I tested this using a modified Jack with 1 crit damage, 0 normal damage, 0 durability loss. With 100% melee skill and 100% player crit chance it took approximately 20 seconds to kill a 500hp deathclaw, aiming at the torso every time, which is 25 dps. There was no significant difference between 1 strength and 10 strength, which indicates bonus damage from strength (and presumably the base weapon damage) either aren't applied or are applied fractionally per tick, making them negligible in comparison to critical damage. Since normal damage is 0 and the bonus damage from strength vanishingly small, 25 dps equates to 25 critical checks per second.
 * I haven't done the maths like you have, but your info seems right. This thing can do just silly amounts of damage outside of VATS because of this. I'd even say that it can put the shiskebab or Jingwei's shocksword to shame with a high enough crit %. 68.49.187.181 04:00, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually it gets better. I tested on hard, which either ups enemy HP or lowers your damage or both.  In normal difficulty my modified Jack takes down a deathclaw in ~15 seconds.  So the actual tick rate is 33 ticks/sec.  To put this in perspective, with a 33% crit chance (Ninja + Finesse + 10 luck + survival guru) you do +22.5 damage per critical 11 times per second (1 out of every 3 hits critical).  That's a whopping 247.5 dps, all armor ignoring and that's on top of whatever piddly normal damage it does.  Anything you touch gets instagibbed.  Let's not even talk about the 50% extra limb damage.
 * This weapon is GODLY with sneak attack. Chinese stealth armor, ninja, bettercrit. Basically, you'll mow down a Supermutant behemoth in less than half a second. The base damage is 40, so I'll assume the crit damage per hit is 40. with better crit = 60.... add 25% for ninja 75 damage per critical. x2 for sneak =150. Behemoth with 2000 health/150 = 13.33 hits. Jack hits more than 30 times a second. Behemoth = buh bye >;D --LAffindude 02:07, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

On the xbox on very hard, it takes me somewhere between 20-30 seconds to kill a Behemoth with max luck, finesse, guru and ninja. The initial strike(s) however hit very hard taking about 15ish percent off. This was tested on the behemoth outside GNR. It's still god mode though, as melee remains at caution with the chinese stealth armor in spite of all the noise ^_^ allowing you to kill the Behemoth safely but it seems to take significantly longer than 0.5 seconds.80.47.175.248 13:22, 29 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Meh, I tested this on a power armored follower and it wasn't as effective as the shish. Overhyped.--81.156.111.146 19:52, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

LAffindude - According to the wiki the base dmg is 35, and nowhere does it say the weapon is armor ignoring...

The thing is, against tough melee enemies on very hard you're not going to want to stand there holding out this weapon because although your damage will be good, you will be beaten up badly by the enemy. Meanwhile, the annoying backpeddling that some ranged enemies commit makes it very hard to hold them in place to 'hack' with this weapon. I'd rather the DC Gauntlet with Paralyzing palm any day.--Grandmaster Chen 18:02, September 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * The weapon is fine on Very Hard, but its main drawback is that is has a rather low range, even for a melee weapon. A weapon like the Auto Axe works the same way, but has a much longer range. 68.192.9.90 20:51, October 15, 2009 (UTC)`


 * I agree with Chen somewhat. While it's easy enough to kill regular enemies with this weapon, you'll still take damage and risk hurting your followers, and most weapons can kill most enemies easily on very hard.  Where this weapon really fails is when you'd actually want to use the DPS: against Overlords, Reavers and Albino Scorpions.  All 3 of those will just kill you while you're standing there like an idiot.  Against overlords on Very Hard you'll survive at most maybe 2 blasts from the tri-beam from full health, and they are very hard to keep in one spot as they seem to flee on danger.  You'll definitely want to rather shoot the weapon out of their hands or use the paralyzing palm effect on them, the latter applying to all 3 of these "major" enemy types.  It seems like most of the people commenting on here use the chinese stealth suit and just sneak around, that's more of an effect of the chinese stealth suit being stupid and broken.  Of course virtually any weapon will be good if you're taking advantage of safe mode.  But using the chinese stealth suit is probably the most boring and weak way to play this game.  I also agree with the poster right above me on the Auto Axe, it works the same and the range helps, it seems to keep some enemies a bit too far to really attack you.  69.117.16.124 17:09, November 22, 2009 (UTC)VDP101

Speculation of damage ends now! The wiki says:
 * "...hits over 30 times per second. The listed weapon damage is divided over the individual hits, but the critical bonus damage is not."

So, with 10 luck, finesse, and ninja this weapon has a 30% crit chance.

30 hits/sec * 30% crit chance = 9 critical hits / sec

9 critical hits / sec * 22.5 dmg / critical hit = 202.5 dmg / sec (Better Criticals required)

Add the regular 35 dmg / sec to that and the dmg / sec value is 237.5!

QED, bitches!!! 68.192.9.90 18:43, October 4, 2009 (UTC)


 * Actually, you forgot the Snide Survival Guru perk, which adds 3% base critical chance to get 33%. Repeating the math, we get 257.75 DPS. However, the article said it hits over 30 times per second, which means it could be more. If it hits 33 times per second as one of the above posters said, we get 280.025 DPS. Therefore, we need confirmation of the exact number of hits per second.--207.112.46.197 22:35, October 16, 2009 (UTC)


 * The reason I don't take that into account is because I usually take the tough version, but yes, I should have included it. thanks. 68.192.9.90 14:49, October 18, 2009 (UTC)


 * The DPS (without criticals) listed in the table in the article has been changed to 30, so the MDPS should now be 252.75.--207.112.56.118 02:06, October 24, 2009 (UTC)

Andale
I talked to old man Harris in Andale, then Mrs. SMith. She said "Jack would need to pay him a visit" Now her husbands name IS Jack, but could it be a nod to the weapon? I found several rippers in the shed.

That's retarded  The.true.samiam 08:00, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

Characteristics
Removed Line: "Jack also seems to ignore Armor, a characteristic similar to that of the Deathclaw Gauntlet. It's no wonder that Bethesda chose to place Jack in the Deathclaw Sanctuary." - GECK indicates otherwise
 * Agreed this no way pierces armor, it sucks against heavily armored enemies such as Enclave.--86.146.1.144 16:24, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Can't find Jack
i can,t find jack. i waited until i finished water of life, to go in there , there where enclave outside , but when i went inside ,there was only one enclave solider but all he was carrying was a plasma pistol. did i do something wrong ??
 * I think its a Broken Steel glitch,happened to me once after finishing Who Dares Win. Captain TattyBoJangles Care to talk? 18:11, September 5, 2009 (UTC)

The officer is much deeper in the caves, look harder. It's not the 1st officer you see. Also, the officer weilding it is female. 68.192.9.90 14:59, October 12, 2009 (UTC)


 * The dead Enclave officer, for me, was in a pile of bodies with a giant ant (empty) and a wasteland merchant. She was further up in the heap than the others, and was definitely not easy to spot. And yeah, it was in the southern part of the caves.76.123.120.56 05:28, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Where is it?
Do I have to complete the Waters of Life or whenever the enclave first come to get it?


 * Yes 68.192.9.90 20:52, October 15, 2009 (UTC)

Quick equation...
what if you add the +5 damage per hit from both Ghoul Ecology and Superior Defender into that 280.025 damage? 'cause i'm trying to decide if i should get jack or shish, cause i have shish with pyro and samurai armor and it does 61, i still haven't got jack yet, but just want to know if it's worth it with the +10 if you add in both perks.... Geomexis 13:50, October 28, 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, those two perks make Ripper or any similar weapon (like Autoaxe) insanely powerful. Every "tick" will give extra +5 damage, leading to killing enemies "on contact". P22 14:27, October 28, 2009 (UTC)

Yah I've been trying to test that. It kills Super Mutants Brutes in almost a 1/2 second, which is the same for the Mauler from the pitt. Standing up w/ about an 18% crit chance and I kill an Overlord in about 3.5 secs. That includes 100 melee and the Samurai armor. Not sure those perks really do affect it though. After all, the +10 from the Samurai armor per hit would be insane too, added together is +20 per 30 hits per second. Add in a stealth boy w/ high sneak and you've got a monster of a weapon (assuming all those perks work). I'm on PS3 though so I can't check the health exactly. Anyone w/ a PC care to do test trails?


 * Well, I tested removing and adding back those perks with console on PC. Autoaxe with no extra perks: kills humans in The Pitt in reasonable time, but it still feels like a challenge (you need to keep cutting them for some time). Autoaxe with just Superior Defender: kills humans almost "on contact" (which looks really messy if you have Bloody Mess perk). Like some sort of super-weapon. Zzzswush, spash! P22 03:21, October 30, 2009 (UTC)


 * Is everyone here playing on normal? B/c I play on VH and Jack is a great weapon, but it takes about 3-4 sec to take down a brute (100 melee weaps, 10 STR, Ghoul ecology and superior defender, Bloody Mess, 100 condition, 10 LK, finesse, snide WSG, ninja, better crits). 69.38.252.83 13:30, November 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * I like playing on very easy so I level up slowly. And because I don't have to waste an entire clip of ammo to kill a stinkin raider.