Talk:12.7mm pistol/Archive 1

AP?
Do they make 12.7 rounds in anything other than armor-piercing? I'd hate to see another huge pistol go to waste. Nitty Tok. 13:47, August 14, 2010 (UTC)

IIRC Sawyer said that every weapon in the game had multiple ammo types, so I wouldn't be too worried. That said, considering its size and alleged stopping-power it's probably going to be a mid-to-late game gun with impressive penetration regardless of what ammo you put in it. 70.72.172.87 18:24, August 14, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, that's what the 14mm was supposed to be. Are you sure that they make hollow point 12.7mm rounds? Please be sure. :P Nitty Tok. 20:28, August 16, 2010 (UTC)

Well, they make Hollow Points in .50AE, .50GI, .500 S&W, and .50 Beowulf, and since this 12.7mm round is supposed to be comparable to any number of these .50 pistol rounds, I would surmise that there would be hollow points for 12.7mm as well. Of course, this is a fictional setting, so even if there were no hollow points made for these rounds, it wouldn't be impossible for them to exist in this universe.--Resplendant Securitron 03:34, September 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Good. I don't want to just be stuck with 12.7mm AP rounds like the last couple hand-cannons. :/ Nitty Tok. 03:41, September 26, 2010 (UTC)

Calibre source
Where is the source for this particular calibre for this handgun? And is 12.7mm equivalent to .50 calibre? 02:38, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * Sawyer is the source.
 * And the .50 round is confirmed as .50 MG, so this gun would be called .50 pistol if .50 MG and 12.7mm were the same. Nitty Tok. 02:42, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well you could say the same thing about 7.62mm and .308 Winchester. I'm 95% certain that 12.7mm is just the metric form of .50. 02:44, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * 7.62x39mm and 7.62x51mm are different enough. If the gun was in .50, it would be called .50 pistol (or they just would have made a Desert Eagle or S&W 500 knockoff.) The 14mm fired a huge Russian HMG round, so the 12.7mm might also use a Russian derivative. Nitty Tok. 02:47, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * Not saying that it fires the .50, just that 12.7mm and .50 are veritably the same. It really has no relevance to the game.
 * Wouldn't be the first time two identical ammo sizes were stated differently ingame. -- 03:56, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * That's my point, Kris. 03:59, September 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * What was that, Kris? Example? Nitty Tok. 12:05, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

.50 = 12.7 and is merely the size of the bullet that is fired, not the size of the round itself.Grand Cookie 11:59, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

The sniper rifle in Fallout Tactics was rechambered from .308 to 7.62mm. "By .308, they probably mean 7.62 × 51 mm NATO (as the commercial version is widely known as .308 Winchester) and by 7.62mm, they probably meant 7.62x54mm or 7.62x39mm, the Russian equivalents" So not exactly the same, I suppose. -- 12:18, September 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * And you need to remember that Tactics was never very intelligent. Nitty Tok. 12:20, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Look, if you don't know anything about firearms, don't mess with the edits of those who do. 12.7mm is not "approximately the same" bore diameter of .50 caliber, it's the exact same. Length of the cartridge is a totally different issue; .50 AE (the round the Desert Eagle fires) is of course not the same as the .50 BMG and it's near Russian equivalent, the 12.7mm x 108mm round.

For the purposes of the game, why would the developers use 9mm, 10mm, and .50 cal when they could achieve easy uniformity with the commonly recognizable 12.7mm? 71.74.91.181 19:19, October 20, 2010 (UTC)

--the real reason is probably because they already have .50 cal in the game for the anti-material rifle, and didnt want it to use the same ammunition. the rest of this is nonsense, especially thinking that 12.7mm is anywhere near the same level of common knowledge as .50 cal in the states.

not the most powerful handgun
while its certainly up at the top of the list, this is not the most powerful handgun in new vegas as the description says.

the ranger sequoia has the highest single shot damage, and if you factor in the extra crit multiplier on a character made with a high crit rate would also pass it in DPS.

like my character has 10 luck, built to destroy, finesse, and the +5% crit beret. the difference between a 1x weapon and 1.5x weapon is quite a lot. 23% vs 34.5% ... thats more than enough difference to pass this guns slight base dps edge.

Yes, but you can't seriously believe that we're going to factor in character builds here, right? The 12.7 beats it in DPS, without factoring luck in. TNT Lordofthelargepants The Zipper and The Pockets 12:35, November 6, 2010 (UTC)

its not really luck when you are up to 1 in 3, but ok.

ranger sequoia still has the highest single shot damage, and with the DT system is still going to be more powerful because of that alone.

looking at a dps number and blindly calling it the most powerful is rather ignorant really.

No, it's a statistic. It is the most powerful, not the most effective TNT Lordofthelargepants The Zipper and The Pockets 12:45, November 6, 2010 (UTC)

it would be more accurate to say "this weapon has the highest dps on an unarmored target without critical hits"

saying its the most powerful is very misleading, and in my opinion, just wrong.

Well that's great, but your opinion can hardly dispute facts, now can it? I agree with that saying it is the most powerful could be misleading, but it's still technically true. TNT Lordofthelargepants The Zipper and The Pockets 12:55, November 6, 2010 (UTC)

YOUR opinion can hardly dispute HIS facts.

I came to this talk-page specifically wondering if there'd be some sort of dispute over that silly claim in the article, and whadda ya know, there is one.

This is ridiculous. There shouldn't even be an argument here, because what's right and wrong about this is starkly obvious. The claim in the article is erroneous and misleading, period. "Still technically true"? Please. What actually matters here is that the vast majority of people who read this article are going to think it's telling them that the 12.7 is superior to the Sequoia, and it's just not. Therefore, it defeats the purpose of an informative wiki article by being... uninformative.

You can argue semantics about what "powerful" means all day long, but you're still wrong.

The 12.7mm has the highest non-crit DPS... by a measly 5 point margin. *THAT* IS TECHNICALLY TRUE. You wanna say that? Fine.

You know, if the 12.7 pistol's AP cost wasn't so low, it wouldn't even be the second best non-energy pistol in the game, much less the first. It's highly debatable as to whether or not it's even better than the Hunting Revolver.

In practical reality, the Sequoia is far, faaaar superior. It has DOUBLE the crit-damage bonus, and a higher crit chance multiplier. In real-time with lots of shots being fired very quickly, crits happen often enough that it's just stupid to not consider it when making sweeping, generalized statements like "most powerful in the game". And in VATS, the Sequoia's higher AP cost is easily offset by the fact that you'll be killing most enemies faster with the more frequent crits, and penetrating tough DT much more easily with the dramatically higher damage per shot. And obviously, with automatic sneak criticals, the Sequoia blows away the 12.7 pistol.

I'm editing the article. It's sad that it's only just now happening.

Next time, man up and concede the point, Lordofthelargepants.

Sign your posts next time, and it's not my opinion, I'm just stating the facts, not being opinionated at all. I'm not wrong, and you're doing your best contradicting yourself in your slab of text, you're telling me I'm wrong, then it's technically true, which is all I've been saying, all the time. I wonder what point you're trying to make here. And next time, try to keep it more professional. We tend to frown on "calling out" people, like what you did in your last line of text. I'm not trying to tell everybody that they should dump their revolvers and take out the 12.7, I'm just saying that what the article stated is technically true. You have, in fact, not given a single reason why what I said is wrong, and you even agreed with me. TNT Lordofthelargepants The Zipper and The Pockets 07:08, November 9, 2010 (UTC)

Umm...I dont think you understand what powerful means...Ranger Sequoia is the most POWERFUL because it does the most damage and therefore has more POWER. This gun has the higher DPS and should be stated that way because it doesnt have more power is has higher DPS.--Ze5ro1 02:44, January 29, 2011 (UTC)


 * Good god. The semantics are irrelevant. The point made above about not confusing visitors to the page with misleading or easily-misinterpreted descriptions is the most pertinent. Personally, I find the rapid reload on the 12.7mm far more relevant than someone who uses it for sneak attack criticals would, because I use it for close range defense instead of opening combat with it. I don't think the Sequoia is directly comparable in that situation. Herpderping about exact definitions of 'powerful'....well, at least it didn't dissolve into an edit war, I suppose. 81.178.134.232 03:34, March 6, 2011 (UTC)

All this crap
What's the proper source of the 12.7mm being a SIG-Sauer creation? Buster from NCR is no source when he doesn't even exist in New Vegas, much less his dialogue file. Nitty Tok. 23:28, November 6, 2010 (UTC)
 * It looks identical to the FO1/2 14mm pistol, so it's pretty clear that it's the same weapon, with versions chambered with different ammo. Ausir(talk) 23:06, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

Where's The Ammo?
I bought the 12.7mm weapon fairly early on, but could never find anyone selling the ammo for it, so didn't get much use out of it. I'm now around Level 28-29 and went back to Daniel Contreras at Camp McCarran supply shack to sell off some loot and he had over 1200 rounds of regular 12.7mm and some more armor-piercing. Is he the only one selling the ammo in any quantity?

Gun Runners sell it if you're high enough level. My experience has been you can reliably find it from about Lv16 onward, but that's my experience, not the game files or any other authoritative source. Take with appropriate grain of salt. SimuLord 11:56, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

12.7mm DMG listed at 40, but I am seeing it in-game at 41.
The 12.7mm pistol is listed at 40. I have the game on now, with the gun equipped with regular ammunition. My guns skill is at 100, and the DMG says 41. Can someone else confirm this? If so it should be changed. (Ninety9Soulz 23:47, December 3, 2010 (UTC))


 * Do you have Bloody Mess as a perk? The   Jovar  00:00, December 4, 2010 (UTC)

I didn't take into account the 'Lord Death' Perk actually, that is most likely what put it over.Ninety9Soulz 11:16, December 25, 2010 (UTC)