Talk:Sneak Attack Critical

S.A.C.

 * One Sneak Attack Critical on the head of a Super Mutant Master kills him instantly(100% repaired Lincoln's Repeater, 100% Small Guns skill), but it takes more than one standard critical hit on the head to kill him. I do not have the Better Criticals perk.BSMaker 00:44, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Its always seemed like sneak criticals ignore armor (Damage Resistance), never seen it written anywhere though. --AshRandom 00:53, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Is the 'green' HIDDEN a reference to the default PipBoy HUD color? If so, text should be corrected.
 * What? Uh, no, character status is either green (in the case of hidden) or red (in the case of caution and danger).
 * Its blue if your HUD is blue, orange if your HUD is orange, etc.Galcoe 04:21, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Bah, default is green, thus the hidden template is green, if people changed their HUD color then they can just make the giant mental leap required to connect the dots.


 * It has to be more than just ignoring armor. The deathclaw gauntlet one shot kills with a sneak attack critical, but not with a regular crit, and already ignores armor. Also, at least with the iron fist perk, it is an excellent sneak attack weapon due to the x5 multiplier.--Phlinn 01:50, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * See the Critical Hit page. Wait no don't... it looks like its specific to Fallout 1&2... [[Image:Ash_Nuke.jpg]] AshRandom (Talk) 02:35, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Well it has always been my experience that if you do enough damage to any one limb even the toughest creatures drop dead. I can't say how it works, but it seems like attacking an already crippled limb does double damage... Attacking the head seems to do does double damage too, which might explain why attacking someone's crippled head always seems to instantly kill them, perhaps it does x4 dmg at that point? I wish we had some real information on the Fallout 3 damage system. [[Image:Ash_Nuke.jpg]] AshRandom (Talk) 02:47, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Headshots: 2x Damage. Criticals: +critical damage, NOT armor piercing. This damage is multiplied by the headshots bonus. Sneak Criticals: 2x Damage. So, a sneak attack headshot = 4x damage multiplier, explaining the overkills. Picture this: Lincoln's repeater + Better Criticals. Headshot: 50 * 2 = 100 DMG(if you ignore DR.) Critical Headshot: (50 + 75) * 2 = 250 DMG Sneak Critical Headshot: ((50 + 75) * 2) * 2) = 500.
 * Sneak Attack Criticals have, indeed, a multiplier. Upon lurking the bethesda forums for knowledge about the wierd Gauss Rifle, someone posted what I was wanting to know about this:

You know how much HP a Deathclaw has? 500. Did you notice that having a Lincoln's Repeater at 49 DMG isn't enough to kill a deathclaw? Well, it leaves it with 4HP.

Just for fun, let's see how much DMG a Gauss Rifle SHOULD deal, with the Better Criticals perk.

Headshot: 100 * 2 = 200 DMG Critical Headshot: 175 * 2 = 350 DMG Sneak Critical Headshot: ((175 * 2) * 2)700 DMG <- Ouch. A really nasty boo boo.BSMaker 02:57, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * YAY! No more guessing and theories :) Post it to the article! [[Image:Ash_Nuke.jpg]] AshRandom (Talk) 03:11, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

GECK wiki said the crit DMG is added after armor, so the calculation should be [DMG * 2(if headshot) * 2(if sneak crit)] * (100-DR)% + crit DMG I suppose? --NovaRain 03:53, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Hm... nice point.
 * BSMaker 04:12, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Ha! My wittle theory wasn't so crack-pot after all ;) AshRandom (Talk) 04:13, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Guess the picture I made for this page has suddenly become relevant ;) hahaha!

His test with a Gauss Rifle(90DMG) on an enemy with 50% DR with no Better Criticals perk showed that a shot to the head dealt exactly half the damage of a shot on an enemy with 0%DR. If the critical bonus were added after the armor penalty, it would have dealt 100 more DMG.
 * Er... this game wants to make me go insane. The GECK wiki says the damage is added after the DR, but a test from a user of the bethesda forums says otherwise.
 * The tests can be found here: http://www.bethsoft.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=949258&st=0&gopid=13724254&#entry13724254 BSMaker 04:30, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Oh great, he also tested the sniper rifle, so the crit DMG is still affected by DR. Guess GECK wiki is less trustworthy right? (yeah, I remember the DPS stuff in weapons) :\ --NovaRain 04:42, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

So, if i'm,not mistaken, a Sneak attack critical will double the total damage ( Reg. dmg + Crit dmg, then doubling that dmg?) So a SAC wont double the Critical damage alone for a weapon? For instance, Microwave emitter does 60 Dmg base, but has a 100 Crit, it it were to hit in SAC, the Crit would then be 200, thus doing 260 dmg. Correct me please if i'm mistaken--Nosferus 20:54, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

GECK errors
Whatever you do, don't be shocked when the GECK's wrong. The entire weapons list DPS is so screwed up it's beyond repair, I gave up bothering with it on a case-by-case basis and decided calculate it all myself. Then because we have a few GECK fanatics and to aswage my own fears that even base-item-data taken from the GECK might be wrong (it isn't, seems like it's just the big calculations that turned out badly) Fiddlesoup and I have been doing stopwatch trials to back up the data. I'll be glad when we're done with it. AshRandom (Talk) 04:42, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Got it, sorry for bringing up the false information from GECK wiki. :( --NovaRain 04:45, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It's nobody's fault for trusting an "official" editor... [[Image:Ash_Nuke.jpg]] AshRandom (Talk) 04:48, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

I found a much easier way to do these calculations (yay math!)

DAM/SEC = ( DAM/SHOT + CRIT CHANCE * CRIT MULTIPLER * CRIT DAM ) * SHOTS/SEC

Note that this is for real time combat only (no VATS), crit chance is out of 100 ( so 18% crit chance = 0.18 in the equation) and crit damage is increased by 50% with Better Criticals. 68.192.9.90 00:18, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

Stabhappy Anyone?
Can someone add the info for Stabhappy to the list of the weapons there? The dagger has a very high Critical hit perentage and with the right perks (such as finesse and ninja), it can gain a 100% critical hit chance (according to the article). In fact, while you're at it, add Firelance too. With its insanely high Critical multiplier, and with perks like better criticals and pyromaniac, I'm pretty sure that it would be by FAR the best weapon for critical hits. --Clean Up 22:30, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

SAC with Mines
perhaps it should be noted that mines can be used for a Sneak attack Critical. I accidentally did it against a Metro security robot
 * Yep, mines are considered silent in the way that the enemy won't be alerted until it explodes. At that point, the damage is already done so it doesn't matter whether they are suspicious or not...--Amitakartok 23:03, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Terrible Shotgun
Either some info is not included on this page, or the damage calculation is wrong for this weapon. The Terrible Shotgun, with a sneak critical, outside of VATS, with all pellets striking and the Better Criticals perk, does over 1250 damage (because it kills Super Mutant Overlords on Normal Difficulty with shots directly to the back of the torso). I realize the discrepancy is not large (or at least, I can't tell if it's large), but I thought I'd point it out. I'm absolutely certain I did not have either perk from Point Lookout that would increase my damage, and I took no Psycho/Yao Guai meat, etc.

That info is at the bottom of the page. - RASICTalk 11:57, November 27, 2009 (UTC)

terrible shotgun vs paulson revolver
I have tested the paulson revolver vs the terrible shotgun from the feet of a super mutant behemoth while cloaked with 100 stealth and a CSA. I shot the terrible shotgun at his head while croutched and it did not hit as high as the paulson revolver. they were very close ~100 difference. I do remember that the revolver did 2294.02 and the terrible shotgon did 100~ less. This is probably due to the 3vs6 spread diference. Gary 23 12:31, March 13, 2010 (UTC)

assume
with these calculators for shotgun type weapons, are you putting in effect the spread? that would be pretty hard huh. or, are you assuming that you are 1 inch away from the face and assuming that all shots hit?

Unarmed Sneak Attack
Surprisingly, the page doesn't point out that instead of double, unarmed sneak attacks (even with unarmed weapons) do five times the damage. Factoring in Perks like Ninja, Superior Defender, Ghoul Ecology, and ahem, Iron Fist, that's a whole lotta punch. 03:40, November 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * If only there was a way for someone to add that information to the page... -- 03:45, November 18, 2010 (UTC)

FO:NV Crit differences
It should be noted that according to the GECK for FONV, most multi-projectile weapons have had their crit dmg lowered to around the same damage as a regular projectile hit, rather than the larger "Full hit" crit numbers from FO3. Thus, in most cases if a "shotgun" style weapon had all projectiles crit, it would be more along the lines of a normal critical hit with any other weapon. Compare:

(Numbers are generally rounded for simplification, but total dmg & crit dmg should turn out close to the same)

FO:NV Dinner Bell:

Base: 7 projectiles x 10.7 damage = 75 total damage regular hit

vs

Crit: 7 projectiles x 21.7 damage (10.7 base damage + 11 crit damage) = 151.9 damage crit * 2 SAC multiplier = 303.8

FO3 Terrible Shotgun:

Base: 9 projectiles x 8.8 damage = 80 total damage regular hit

vs.

Crit: 9 projectiles x 48.8 damage (8.8 base damage + 40 crit damage) = 439.2 damage crit * 2 SAC multiplier = 878.4

Thus, sneak attack criticals with multi-projectile weapons are more balanced vs single projectile weapons when compared to the FO3 equivalents, which tended to have rapid "inflation" of crit dmg when all projectiles crit. Unfortunately these changes also mean a multiple projectile weapon that doesn't crit on all projectiles fired is noticeably weaker than the FO3 counterparts, but that's not related to the SAC article directly, just pointing it out.

The reason I'm not editing the article directly is because I don't know if the #s in the Geck are directly comparable from FO3 to FO:NV, or if the mechanics for checking for criticals on multi-projectile weapons have changed along with the lower crit dmg bonuses. I'm also not much of a tester so I'm not much use in figuring out ways to establish how much dmg this is actually doing in-game, someone may want to look into it.

Barring further testing aside, should this information be worked into the article? Seroster 99.28.99.152 01:19, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

DT reduction
At what point in calculation DT reduction occurs? I guess it's subtracted from base damage in the beginning of calculation. So if a weapon does 52/52 damage and target has 15 DT, we do SAC to the head: (52-15+52)*2*2=356dmg. Amirite? &mdash;01:46, August 16, 2011 (UTC)

Silent kill with energy weapons in NV?
Is it possible to perform a silent kill (like one with sniper rifle or .22 silenced pistol) with energy weapon in New Vegas? It seems to be impossible..
 * There are no energy weapons in NV that have their detection sound level set to "silent".--The Gunny 23:22, November 2, 2011 (UTC)

Is this in Fallout 4?
Is this in Fallout 4 or is the mechanics different?--Ant2242 (talk) 12:38, 27 April 2016 (UTC)