User talk:Lakewalker42

X-01 power armor crafting
Hi!

You can fix the crafting section of the X-01 power armor (Fallout 76) by editing the following templates:
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave ArmLeft
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave ArmRight
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave Helmet
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave LegLeft
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave LegRight
 * Template:F76 co PowerArmor X01Enclave Torso

By the way, welcome to the Vault! --  -- You talkin' to me? -- cCContributions -- 12:53, 8 January 2019 (UTC)


 * I don't have access to Fallout 76, so I can't tell much about this …


 * "Using actual numbers, like the 50's in these templates and the 50-somthings in the modding templates is confusing." - Huh?


 * How does the game itself order the required materials? Alphabetically, too? Or … otherwise? -- UserCCCSig.png  -- You talkin' to me? -- cCContributions -- 08:20, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

Template values
Hey man, I've added the templates en masse using the exported values straight from the game's files. There's something freaky going on with the data behind the scenes, I agree, so feel free to correct them. I'd recommend using level 50 as reference, though, since it's the most quantities ever needed by the game.

I wonder, are the increases in ingredients needed a constant percent? Tagaziel (talk) 18:27, 9 January 2019 (UTC)


 * And according to the upper topic and my own talk page:


 * Would it be useful to split values by levels, either with additional template parameters or by simply using e.g. "45/50" as values?
 * If we go with straight alphabetical order of the ingredients, Lakewalker42, you have to switch the ingredients themselves, not the whole rows inside the template as you did here: on the article it's still ordered by the number behind "component"; I've left it this way so you'd have an example.
 * I could create the needed templates for the whole armor(s).
 * By the way, now I've understood what you were speaking about. ;) -- UserCCCSig.png  -- You talkin' to me? -- cCContributions -- 18:51, 9 January 2019 (UTC)

Summarizing

 * Moved from User talk:CompleCCity

Yes, I believe that there should be separate rows for each level. The 40/50 might be cumbersome with Raider armor which has four levels. Counting all levels of all 7 power armor types, I get 18 which should not be unmanageable. Viewers are most interested in comparing armors that they can use at their current level so it would be most useful ordered by level then by type. While T-60 level 50 has more than twice the protection of Raider level 15, it's only 15% better than Raider level 45 and there are those who would rather choose the more lore friendly "thrown together" look of the Raider set. Changing the template was an error. I totally missed the numbering in the template line designation. I have restored order to the line numbering in legs and torso so screws now precede springs & steel. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment was added by Lakewalker42 (talk • contribs) 02:03, January 10, 2019. Please sign your posts with ~ !
 * Raider 15/25/35/45
 * Excavator 25/35/45
 * T-45     25/35/45
 * T-51     30/40/50
 * T-60        40/50
 * X-01        40/50
 * Ultracite      50


 * I've moved your last comment to this place, Lakewalker42, so we have that discussion all on one place. Further replies about the topic go here, then. (By the way, remember signing your talk page comments with  ;)


 * Still I'd like to have Tagaziel's opinion on that level split and how he thinks this could best be achieved … -- UserCCCSig.png  -- You talkin' to me? -- cCContributions -- 07:29, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

Continued
Hey, thanks for the kind words! I structured the templates deliberately to allow for sanely correcting them in one place, instead of having to hunt down the fuckers all over the wiki. Now...

The way I see it, the ESM for the game contains COBJ entries (constructible object) that has the basic values. However, since everything is leveled, there's also a second component: The curve tables. These are in a plaintext format and the values from the ESM are first passed through the curve table before being used by the game. I can send you the curve tables so that we can figure out something that isn't an ad-hoc solution. :) Tagaziel (talk) 16:50, 10 January 2019 (UTC)

Curve tables
Yes, you may send me the curve tables. We can look for a relationship that supports the numbers seen when playing. My email is dale@lakewalker.net. You can use that unless there's a better way to send them. Thanks. Lakewalker42 (talk) 21:10, 10 January 2019 (UTC) Lakewalker42 (talk) 21:10, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Here's a link to my Dropbox. I hope these are the most up to date, I exported them from my laptop. If there are any discrepancies, I'll update them when I get home. For power armor pieces, the cost seems to scale per component type, rather than per component. I divided the ingredients into the common/rare/etc. categories on the crafting page, so that should help, I hope. Tagaziel (talk) 10:57, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

I've looked at the cobj_pa tables and can't see a correlation. First, there are 5 tables going from "supercommon" to "veryrare". As you would expect, the "Y" values are greatest in the first and smallest in the last. Looking at Excavator power armor, the exported values for all components for all armor pieces on the page were all 10's. These have been updated by someone else and their numbers match what I have seen in the game. In the Excavator tables there are now 7 distinct values in the 9 different components at any given level. With all base values = 10, it would take 7 modifiers and there are only 5 tables. In addition, springs, that would probably be classed as uncommon require 30 for each leg while only 17 steel are needed, steel being the most common component in Appalachia. For them to use these tables as modifiers, the base number for springs in the legs would have had to be much higher than 10. Also, looking at the components needed for X-01, the exported values were all 50's. The amounts of components actually needed are about 10% more than the Excavator set, not 5 times as much.

The exported values have a definite pattern: All values for crafting each set were all the same for all components: Raider:   10 Excavator: 10 T-45:     20 T_51:     30 T_60:     40 X-01:     50 Ultracite: 50 While they are not the levels at which the armors first can be used, they roughly appear to be rankings for the armors rather than component amounts. Is it possible that the values were exported from the wrong column?
 * These are taken straight from the ba2 archive that the game uses, so I don't think that's the case. More likely, the system might work differently than I think. Are the values in the ESM used at all? Or do the curve tables override them? If so, how are they processed? Are if not, do they act as multipliers, divisors, or something else entirely? The hp/Dr/dam values are used straight. BTW, have you checked that you don't have any crafting mods enabled? I keep forgetting I have level 2 bandolier and most ballistic ammo is weightless.
 * One last suggestion: Remember to sign your posts with four tildes ( ~ ) so that I dpnt look like I'm talking to myself. ;) Tagaziel (talk) 09:05, 14 January 2019 (UTC)

I have disabled all perks when researching crafting amounts. You are right, they can have an effect although none that I have now do. "Power Smith" does but I currently only use "Fix It Good" which does not. It does however boost DR while armor is over 100% so I don't have accurate values there until the armor wears down below 100%. I'm just saying that it doesn't sound logical that the values that Bethesda uses would be based on 10,10,10,10,10 for an Level 25 Extractor PA leg when the in-game values are 6,9,10,30,17 and then, for level 40 x-01, use 50,50,50,50,50,50 when the real values are 13,13,12,13,45,22. Later, when I have time, I'll look into extracting ESM data, just can't get into that now. Thanks, Lakewalker42 (talk) 20:47, 14 January 2019 (UTC)