Talk:Four Eyes

Fully utilizing the trait.
It should be noted in the article that taking this Trait effectively lowers your base Perception by 1 point, when attempting to qualify for perks. It's actual effect is to raise the Perception bonus of most eyewear to +2 instead of the normal +1. SagaDC 23:55, October 19, 2010 (UTC)

Okay, so, if I am reading this correctly: Let's say you start with perception 5, then take the Four Eyes trait. Your perception is now 4, and wearing glasses gets you +2, i.e. 6. Sounds good right? Wrong! Because without the trait you had perception 5 and glasses gave you PER +1 which came to... 6. So if this is the case all the trait does is take away 1 point of PER unless you wear glasses. Which is NOT what the in game description leads you to believe. Do glasses actually give a perception bonus to players without Four Eyes? This should be on the article/page to explain fully, once it is clarified. 7h1s 10:21, October 21, 2010 (UTC)

I took this because I fancied wearing glasses anyway, but its behavior seems pretty broken to me. It does apparently lower your base perception by 1 point, not as an effect. As it is right now, it's a useless trait that forces you to wear glasses to suffer no ill effect but gives you no bonus over a character with the trait who is also wearing glasses. --Thousandfracture 00:42, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes this appears to be broken. First it shouldn't change your base perception. That is the problem. Or if it changes it, it should change it back to whatever it is when you put on glasses. I'm really disappointed by this bug as it's very basic.--Crossmr 01:29, October 23, 2010 (UTC)

Use of this perk allows a level 2 character to attain Agility 10 and Perception 10 when also wearing a Perception +1 hat. Strength 5, Perception 7 at creation (Intense Training +1, Four Eyes (with glasses) +2 and Hat +1), Endurance 5, Charisma 1, Intelligence 6, Agility 10, Luck 6). Check your status in the pip-boy with the glasses equipped (no hat), it reads Four Eyes - +2 Perception unequip them and it reads -1 perception so there is really nothing wrong with the trait when utilized for min/maxing purposes as no perk requires greater than 6 perception (except infiltrator, and who really uses that perk anyway?). Maximum detect range and extreme movement speed are grand (can outrun a giant rad scorpion you saw coming a mile away). It is also a very effective build due to the fact tagging lockpicking and taking Comprehension allows you to get Lucky very early in the game (55 lockpicking, +20 magazine). If you start with the weathered 10mm pistol (or possibly other pre-order gun weapons) you can kill a cazador in 3 solid headshots (at level 1, 40 gun skill) gaining level 2 off those cazadores near Chance's grave. Mictlantecuhtli 06:13, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * No, there is something clearly wrong with the trait. I started the game with perception 5 and took four eyes. Without anything it reads perception 4 as it should. With glasses it reads as perception 6(+) which is incorrect. It should read as 7(+). 5 for base, +1 for glasses +1 for trait. The problem is when you put on glasses, it doesn't change your base back to 5. Base perception with glasses and no perk already gives us perception 6, this trait is broken.--Crossmr 07:16, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * It does add +2 (it clearly states this in the pip-boy), which does not effect accuracy, skill bonuses, etc. So technically it is still adding +1 while wearing glasses, it is just inconvenient to take +1 more perception to compensate for the -1 to base perception (unless, like me, you built for 10 perception and agility at lvl 2 and so 7 base perception still qualifies me for all perks and gives me 10 perception with glasses, hats and +1 from intense training. It's mildly inconvenient, but not completely broken. Mictlantecuhtli 07:23, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, it adds +2 but only after subtracting 1. What aren't you getting here? Base perception is 5 when I start the game. I take the trait. The trait says "-1 without glasses, +1 with glasses". My base should always be 5 no matter water. But it isn't. The game is permanently lowering the base by 1 regardless of whether or not I'm wearing glasses and that is broken and doesn't function as described. Glasses already give +1. SO let me try to spell this out since you're clearly not getting it:
 * NO PERK
 * Base perception 5
 * Put on glasses (+1)
 * Total perception 6
 * WITH PERK
 * Base perception 5
 * Take perk
 * Base perception lowered to 4 as it should be without glasses
 * put on glasses
 * +2 perception given
 * Total perception 6


 * How is this any better??? It's exactly the same.
 * What should happen is this:
 * Put on glasses
 * base perception changed back to 5
 * +1 for glasses received
 * +1 for perk
 * Total perception 7.
 * I can't make it any clearer than that.--Crossmr 07:30, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Glasses in New Vegas do not add +1 perception without this perk. Mictlantecuhtli 07:32, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Really? Well that clears up my confusion. My apologies. I'd tried to find information on it, but I couldn't get a clear answer on the forums, and the article here on glasses is all about Fallout 3.--Crossmr 07:36, October 23, 2010 (UTC)

No problem, and yes I was disappointed the glasses did not add +1 anymore either. This trait effectively gives them that ability, the forumla I posted is the only way I have found to have x2 SPECIAL stats at 10 when the player reaches level 2 (without compromising combat/skill integrity). Mictlantecuhtli 07:44, October 23, 2010 (UTC)

Like said before, the main problem is the lowering of the base perception, which means you need 7 base perception if you want Better Criticals and Finesse. Secondly, do you want to wear closed helmets? If you don't, and prefer to wear the 1st Recon Beret you get from Boone instead of power armor helmets, then this is not a problem. Flaktrooper November 23, 2010

For those that took this perk I'm thinking about getting it but I have a question. Are glasses easy enough to find for this to be useful? I've never paid attention to how often I found them because I never needed them. Do they run out of HP before you find more? Thanks. For anyone complaining about taking the glasses off, set your per. to 6 if you feel like taking your glasses off you'll have 5 per. 5 per. is fine. By the way I always get jury-rigging what can you repair glasses with with jury-rigging.

Problem with reasoning
Glasses do NOT give a +1 bonus. They only give a +2 bonus when you take Four-Eyes. You lose a point of perception permanently to gain benefit of +2 when wearing glasses. Throw a hat on there and you've got a nice +3 bonus. Only problem is qualifying for perks.


 * Yes, it is very simple and functional when understood. Four Eyes deducts 1 from base Perception and gives all glasses a +2 Perception modifier as an effect. The page info explains it somewhat awkward as it is now. Tried adding in a few pointers, but that was just deleted. I think it's working as intended, and still a great trait for min/maximizers. Currently only lvl 14 so far, with an effective 7/9/10/6/10/10/5 and close to 100 in key skills with modifiers. Coupled with Small Frame and an easily crippled head with only a Beret for protection, in hardcore mode, you have a funny challenge =) For those worrying about base stats and perk requirements, a couple tips:

--Ellusion 18:56, November 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * Starting out with 7 endurance and 9 intelligence, with Four Eyes and Small Frame, you won't loose anything going into lvl 2 (15 skillpoints rounded up) and upping Perception +1 with Intense Training.
 * Seeing as you are going to use glasses, and thus also a hat or similar, there's no point to max Perception (7 should be the highest you take this)
 * The slight challenge is getting to the three Caravan players easily available to you to rack up 4k bottlecaps, and reaching the clinic for the intelligence upgrade to a clean 10 before hitting level 3. Then you won't loose anything skillpoint wise (the halfpoint rounded up) going into level 3, and will probably be able to quickly get 6 more implants for the base stats in a short time. With 7 endurance, you get a freebie endurance implant, and can boost all stats by +1, pluss one special implant, or 6 base stats plus both special implants.

This is actually a great trait for close combat characters
I started an unarmed/melee/speech character with only one perception and one charisma. He's been cruising so far but I wish I had taken this trait because in effect I'd have gotten a free point of perception with no downside.

130.11.35.85 18:42, November 4, 2010 (UTC)Nubbinsworth

Perception bonus in Fallout 3
I don't know who put that they don't provide Perception +1 "as in Fallout 3," but I don't recall glasses adding a bonus to Perception (played the whole game wearing them anyway for the +1 DR they granted), so I've removed those words. The Vault's own page about glasses doesn't mention a Perception bonus. If I'm wrong, someone please fix that detail. Super Duper Mutant 00:31, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

Exploiting?
If you set your base Perception to 1, then take this trait, do you get +2 PER with glasses, for +3 total, thus increasing the available SPECIAL pool by 1? You'd have to suffer the effects of low base Perception or use that one perk to raise Perception, of course, but for anything other than perks, the drawbacks are easily overcome. -- 12:06, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

I tried this, my 'Lucky' Eric has 1perception, but it won't let you take the trait (It's just greyed out, like a broken weapon appeal). 20:53, December 6, 2010 (UTC)

Six String Samurai
The pip-boy icon doesn't look anything like the icon for New Vegas Samurai, which is an obvious reference to that film. Because of this I don't think its acceptable to list such a common derogatory term as being a reference based on the fact the icon wears glasses and nothing else. Mictlantecuhtli 11:21, January 29, 2011 (UTC)