Talk:Workbench crate

Are the skill book rolls 4%(list) %4(science) %??(list)? because I've never found a big book of science but I have found two of the other books from the lists together twice

if so could someone put down the chances on the 3rd book

3 or 4 books
So 3 or 4 in one crate? Any confirmation please? Until then marked for verification. Vladimir-Lem 10:52, June 10, 2011 (UTC)

Checked data by help of the GECK and thus confirmed the appearance of 3 or 4 skill books. However, if 3 skill books appear, one of them will inevitably be a Big Book of Science, because the other check ALWAYS gives TWO skill books! Vladimir-Lem 21:50, June 14, 2011 (UTC)

Was trying to get a "Tales of Junky Town Vendor" and somehow managed a 4 skill book drop. As said one was the Big Book of Science, the next three being Medicine, Lockpick and Stealth. While an awesome drop of four books I was max in all of them so loaded because they all were useless. Typical!! But yes it can be done! Anon. August 27, 2011

When is the loot created?
When you enter the area?

When you open the crate?

HughesJohn 10:57, June 14, 2011 (UTC)


 * The Angel Cave article claims the loot is created on entry to the area. HughesJohn 11:05, June 14, 2011 (UTC)
 * All containers create their contents as soon as you enter the cell they're located in. Nitty Tok. 11:50, June 14, 2011 (UTC)
 * That is absolutely right. I'll put all the information at the top of "Contents". Vladimir-Lem 17:16, June 14, 2011 (UTC)

Math is wrong.
The crates can give 4 skill books with a much higher percentage chance than 0.16%. Out of 200 reloads at Stone Bones, I was able to produce 4 skill books three times, which seems very very unlikely if the chance was a mere 0.16%. At Guarache I was able to achieve 4 books four times out of 200 reloads. Mictlantecuhtli 16:23, August 16, 2011 (UTC)

Cannot be wrong. There are two checks of each creating two books with a chance of 4%, which means the chance of four books would be 4%*4%=0.16%. I think that was pure luck. I also had about 200 reloads in total and it never gave me four skill books. --Vladimir-Lem 12:42, September 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * Any item in the list has a 1/25 chance (due to 25 items) (4%), so two books should be (1/25)*(1/25) or 1/625 (0.16%). The page fails to mention that the container processes the leveled list twice, which is how it can even get four books, so it needs to hit the 0.16% result twice, thus four books should actually be a 0.0256% chance. Positronic Spleen


 * Two books are simply 4% ... Four books are two books twice, which is 4%*4%. Where does the 0.0256% come from, anyway? --Vladimir-Lem 12:44, October 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * I made two mistakes: first, 16% * 16% = 2.56%. Second, the article is confusing, and so I misinterpreted what it meant. I looked it up myself and -- due to poor/no documentation elsewhere -- had believed that each count for the books' leveled list was a separate probability. But that is not the case. There are two checks for the contents, meaning two chances at books, and each time you get one science book, two non-combat books, or no books. Positronic Spleen

Why remove the strategy and math?
The whole Wiki is flooded with suggestions on where and how to get specific items quickly and easily. So what is the reason for calling this one "rubbish"? No one up until now has undone my changes, so I request you give an explanation at least. Especially the location table is very nice to be included on the skill books page, immediately giving the readers the opportunity to see ALL available skill book locations and not only the vanilla ones. Actually, the skill books page is also completely flooded with information you would call "rubbish". Furthermore, the math is something everyone can derive from the information given in the GECK, though it's very time consuming. Again, an explanation for removing it would be nice. Otherwise there is no reason to keep the revision. Vladimir-Lem 06:50, August 25, 2011 (UTC)

If nobody minds, I would like to include the math used to calculate the chances from my revision here on the talk page and put the Locations table back in on the main page. --Vladimir-Lem 09:29, September 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * Why remove the strategy and math? Because strategy is against policy, and if you're seeing it else where - then it should be removed also (or point me in the direct and I will do it). Location of items i.e. skill books, isn't strategy. Telling someone how they should get them is, as it is is subjective and a style of play. The math is ok, if properly formatted - see Barter for an example. But is there a need to show how you worked it out, this isn't a maths exam where you get extra credits for that. User avatar tag.gif Avatar talk.png 10:23, September 28, 2011 (UTC)

Yes, thanks. If I find any, I will report them to you. Makes sense that how the math works is very unnecessary and bloats the main page, but I suppose including it here on the talk page is OK then. Math coming soon! --Vladimir-Lem 11:29, September 28, 2011 (UTC)

Two "checks?"
What do they mean by two checks? As in I check once, no skillbook, wait a few days for the cell to reload and then check again? Or what?


 * To explain, containers use a thing called a Leveled List, which is basically a list of items (or other leveled lists) that can be found in that container (sometimes affected by player level, but not in this case). Anyways, the "two checks" is referring to how the leveled list is processed twice, so it takes two entries from it. One of the entries is another leveled list that spits out exactly two skill books, which means that if the leveled list returns that on both tries, you get four total. It is also possible to get one random piece of junk, then another different random piece of junk. Whether or not the container's contents respawn is unrelated, I actually don't know if these ever do, but I doubt it. Positronic Spleen 15:59, October 23, 2011 (UTC)