Talk:Precision Gatling laser

I bet thats the one the Super Mutant Overlord wields in the famous pre-release-picture. 90.186.225.97 20:09, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

nope, the guy in the mobile enclave base has it. In the armory btw62.163.88.139 20:14, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Worse Than Vengeance
Is it worth noting that this gun was completely obselete from the second it was thought up because of Vengeance? Or am i missing some advantage it has. It just seems like a normal gatling laster with some added damage. Whereas Vengeance has even more damage added and 500 more HP.

Anyway, i wont add it. I'm not too good at all this wiki stuff, i just thought i'd ask about it incase someone wants to include it in the article.--92.9.32.94 13:51, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Dosen't it have better accurcy being named "Precision" after all? Gabriel77cortez 16:00, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Mostly because of insane critical multiplier. x4 for a fast firing weapon? Jesus.

The critical damage multiplier makes it indeed better than Vengeance, just try it ingame, it effectively does more damage. I am not a registered Wiki User here, someone remove this comment about "worse" than Vengeance and clarify that. :)

I edited it, but noted that there is still some debate as to whether it's stronger, will edit that bit out if there is more evidence to support this. Cavesloth 18:41, 8 May 2009 (UTC)Cavesloth

Anyone else notice that it seems to aim itself to some degree? Find a strong enemy outside of VATS and just shoot them. The beams go off the centre of the target reticle and seem to target specific body parts on their own. Mine kept shooting at an Overlord's own gattling laser and head. —Preceding. Please sign your posts with ~ !

I did indeed notice that. -DragonJTSLeave me a message 16:59, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

Hence 'Precision' Fat Man Spoon 17:01, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

Perhaps we should note that it has some sort of auto-aim in the article? Unless other weapons have the same property (which I'm pretty sure they don't).Cavesloth 17:14, 9 May 2009 (UTC)Cavesloth

I started up a new game to play the whole main quest again,but i sorta skipped the GNR stage and just did a speed run,i got this GAtling laser and upon hearing this i wondered how good it is against swarms,i noticed that it may hit multiple enemies at once (GOry Triple kills followed)thus,if used right,itll obsolete vengeance Werewolfhell 15:09, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

I thought all the weapons had auto-aim? Maybe it's more pronounced here for some reason. Anyways, I might as well add that while the chart is a good start, the biggest difference is critical rate, so it should list critical damage and MDPS. It's a bit misleading otherwise. PositronicSpleen 23:50, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the "auto aim" that we're discussing is actually a game mechanic related to the weapon skill. In the interviews leading up to FO3's release, it was revealed that the game would add RPG functionality whether or not the player chose to use VATS. In other words, your weapon skill level influences your chance to hit a target in free-aim mode just as much as in VATS mode. This means that if you're aiming in the right general direction and you pull the trigger, it's actually your skill level that determines whether or not you will hit, NOT the exact movement of your mouse hand! Fallout 3 is NOT a first-person shooter, even though you can play it like one if you want to. Your chance to hit will always depend on your weapon skill (as well as visibility, range to target, weapon condition, and perhaps other factors). To see this in action, fire a minigun with Big Guns skill at 15 and then fire it with Big Guns at 100. At 15, you'll see bullets going EVERYWHERE... it's a miracle you don't shoot yourself in the back of the head! But at 100 skill, even a minigun will produce a fairly tight stream of tracers. My theory is that the "auto aim" we're noticing is simply the game using your weapon skill (undoubtedly very high since this is a level 20-30 expansion for most of the people playing it) combined with the weapon's very low (or nonexistent?) spread, essentially sending a tight stream of lasers into the target. Incidentally, if you're firing in free-aim mode, the game will choose a target location for you (arm, head, weapon, etc), most likely based on whichever body part you're aiming the closest to. So when you see the Precision Gatling Laser "homing in" on a specific body part, it's because that's the location that the game decided you would hit. So-called "free aim" shooting is always going to be a little weird in FO3, because it *IS* a role-playing game, and combat is based on stats and skills regardless of whether or not you use VATS (although some of the math is very different, like the way crits are calculated). All right, enough theorycrafting, and sorry for the wall of text, lol. Just my two caps. 12.204.48.130 10:14, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

The above wall of text is a nice theory, but it's wrong and it's not like testing it against a standard gatling laser doesn't make the difference quite obvious. Skill impacts first-person firing by increasing spread above the baseline if the players's skill is not 100. It has nothing to do with behind-the-scenes mechanics in the manner the above post posits.

Using the formula for MPDS from the weapon overview page and a 15 % base crit chance gives 108.8 DPS with the Precision Gattling Laser compared to 110,9 for the Vengeance. Quite theoretical but in numbers, Vengeance is just the better weapon, getting even more beneficial for chars with low luck and no Finesse.


 * I can't find the MDPS formula on the weapons page. I'm trying to verify whether the MDPS value (92) for this gun in the weapons page is correct or not. Since the actual critical multiplier per shot is 0.2, there should only be a 1% chance to get a critical hit based on the given Vault administration's definition of MDPS. Since this translates to 0.1 critical hits out of 10 hits per half-second on average, the difference between the DPS and MDPS should be less than 1.--207.112.46.197 21:50, October 16, 2009 (UTC)


 * I've worked out the formula for MDPS. This is a more generalized derivation of the average DPS value used for the Jack as was done in the Discussion page. Keep in mind that this is an average DPS and should not be treated as consistent DPS.
 * $$MDPS=C_{Base} C_{Mult} D_{Crit} R_{Hits/s} + B_{DPS}$$

where, $$C_{Base}$$ = Your character's base critical chance as a decimal value from 0 to 1. $$C_{Mult}$$ = Weapon critical multiplier. $$D_{Crit}$$ = Weapon critical hit damage. Add 50% if you have Better Criticals. $$R_{Hits/s}$$ = Weapon rate of fire in number of hits per second. $$B_{DPS}$$ = Base DPS of the weapon/non-critical hit DPS

Let me know if you see an error with this formula. --207.112.56.118 14:59, October 24, 2009 (UTC)


 * Using the formula, if you have a character with 18% base critical chance and Better Criticals perk, the Precision Gatling Laser's MDPS is,
 * $$MDPS=0.18 \cdot 0.2 \cdot 9 \cdot 20 + 160 = 166.48$$

The Vengeance's MDPS is,
 * $$MDPS=0.18 \cdot 0.05 \cdot 18 \cdot 20 + 220 = 223.24$$

We see that the Vengeance beats the Precision Gatling Laser by 56.76 MDPS even though the character is built for critical hits.--Ehplee 21:46, October 24, 2009 (UTC)
 * I think that this gun is worst than Vengeance by a slight margin. I did some testing on Enclave soldiers and found that the Precision took 20 shots to rip one in half while Vengeance took 14. This isn't that great of a test as Vengance did get in a headhot or two but even then, Vengeance. I will still have to do more testing to find out the actual verdict. I just got to make sure that Fawkes and Charon are far enough behind...--KnightNapier 02:49, November 27, 2009 (UTC)

X4 crit multiplier
This weapon is much powerful than Vengeance, I often vaporize enemies when playing on hard difficulty. I find that it can kill Enclave faster than Vengeance.

Does this weapon really have a x4 crit multiplier? -RickDicolus

Yes it does

Assuming 10 luck, finesse, survival guru for a base 18% critical chance. Precision gatling laser: = 8 dmg/shot + .72(%crit chance with the 4x multiplier) x6critdmg(damage added per crit strike =4.32additional dmg per shot on avg=12.32 dmg/shot avg

Vengeance= 11 dmg/shot + 0.09x12(9% crit rating from 0.5x multiplier, 12 crit dmg) = 1.08 additional dmg per shot on avg= 12.08 dmg per shot on avg. Precision beats Vengeance by a TINY MARGIN...ONLY at really high crit chances(really only at lvl 30 if you're taking almost perfect).

This doesn't even take better critical's into account, which would make Precision gatling laser even stronger at 18% base crit. Anything lower than 18% base, you want to use vengance instead.

Spread
Is that true? Or did somebody not add the spread to the infobox? //--TehK 15:59, 10 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I noticed that too, the table and the infobox don't match. Being "precision" should have an effect on spread, but use seems to result in it actually having spread. I'll let someone with a GECK figure it out. Nitpicker of the Wastes 19:01, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

The article now says "The Precision Gatling Laser has a tighter spread than the normal Gatling Laser and the unique Vengeance. Wheras (sic) they both have a maximum spread of 2.0, the Precision Gatling Lasers maximum spread is 1.3, making it more predictable and accurate." The table right below this says they both have a spread of 0.5. Huh? 24.206.108.108 09:07, September 27, 2009 (UTC)
 * According to the Prima guide (not sure it's 100% accurate) all Galting Lasers have a .5 spread. Now that's with 100 Big Guns but in using Gatling Lasers, they seem pretty accurate. They're great for ripping appart enemies and the Precision model is even better thanks to its much higher critical chance. It's a fun gun.--KnightNapier 00:10, November 26, 2009 (UTC)

Not really 72% crit chance, unless I'm mistaken
Might want to remove either the "72%" comment on this article, or the line from the Fallout 3 weapons page which reads "Please note that, for automatic weapons (assault rifles, SMGs, Miniguns, etc.) the Crit % Mult stat in the GECK is divided by the GECK's Fire Rate stat, hence the very small multiplier for automatic weapons. This is done to compensate for the sheer number of bullets being fired." I take this to mean that the game will actually divide your 72% crit chance by either 8 or 10 (whatever the GECK's "fire rate" stat is, I'm not sure), leaving you with something like a 7-9% chance for each shot to critically hit. I'm not sure which page is correct, but I don't see how they can both be right. Just trying to make a helpful suggestion, not meaning to seem critical. Ooooh.... no pun intended! 12.204.48.130 08:18, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Nope, it really IS a 72% crit chance--Warhammerork 02:15, 17 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Nope, it's not. I did test with LK 10 character with max skill in Energy weapons, Finesse perk and this weapon fully repaired. Based on your calculations, he should crit (10+5)*4=60% of the time with every single beam, which is untrue (and would be very noticeable, if it worked). Actual critical chance is closer to 60/20=3% which you get if you properly divide your value with ROF for this weapon (which is 20). Of course, VATS still get's it's +15% bonus, so actual critical chance in it is 3+15=18% (also close to in game experience). P22 05:01, September 10, 2009 (UTC)

Remember, too, that VATS adds a flat 15% to your chance to critical, meaning every single beam in VATS has an 87% chance of being a critical hit (provided you have 10 luck, the Finesse perk, and the snide Wasteland Survival Guru perk). Some Sort 05:38, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Actual true critical multiplier for automatic weapons (miniguns and gatlings included), is critical multiplier value from GECK, divided by rate of fire (20 in this case). x0.05 value for normal gatling is such divided value (it has x1 in GECK), so comparing it to x4 from this weapon is misleading.

Now, it may be worth checking, just in case, if such formula really holds up in VATS (since in VATS, all bullets in single volley give critical damage at once, so crits are not calculated on per bullet basis, but per VATS shot). P22 08:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Aim-Assist?
Can we get a GECKie to check for a script? That sounds fishy. Nitty 23:15, September 2, 2009 (UTC)


 * There's no script and no object effect applied to the database object. http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/5899/startreko.jpg So there's no auto-aim other than the typical one. --96.243.180.45 17:18, September 4, 2009 (UTC)


 * Vengeance exhibits the same auto-aiming feature, it is not unique to the precision version.

Armory master may despawn quite quickly
Beware that for some reason the armory master may despawn quite quickly when killed, taking the precision laser and his unique helmet with him into nirvana. On the PC, you can re-enable his dead body by typing into the console:

prid xx008894 (where xx is the mod index of brokensteel.esm) enable

I can confirm this for the PC version, I have no idea why his corpse is disabled, all other corpses are still there. The main page lists this bug for the PS3 version, but exactly the same thing is also true for the PC version of the game.

The weapon is quite weak, actually. It deals less damage than Vengeance, so it will NOT kill a mireluk king/deathclaw/enclave hellfire trooper with a single vats sneak burst to the head on hardcore difficulty (only the alien blaster and vengeance can do that, neither the precision laser nor the gauss rifle do enough damage even if you got all perks including superior defender). WRFan 02:45, December 21, 2009 (UTC)